In this clip from the Off The Cuff Podcast, Mike the Cop and Dave discuss the recent example of “standing your ground” out of Clearwater, FL.
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49 thoughts on “Stand Your Ground – Florida Parking Lot”
Obviously there is a LOT more angles and things to think about and discuss when it comes to the Stand Your Ground version of self-defense laws vs. Castle doctrine style laws. This is simply a clip from our show where we discussed this case briefly. This is by no means exhaustive so don't make it out to be 🙂
Thumbnail, but no video?
There are too many Karens and too many short tempers, people on edge. I'd have avoided the whole thing.
The guy was found guilty of manslaughter. I think he should've gotten more. The 1st reason being he was the instigator. The 2nd reason was the person was walking away. As a ccw hell as a normal person I would not instigate a situation like that to begin with. Some of these people who carry think they can do anything. If he wasn't "armed" would he have instigated it to begin with?
I'm 40 but disabled, while I wouldn't start a fight with someone over a handicap space ,if I was pushed to the ground like that and the person came at me I definitely would be justified in using deadly force to stop that threat
2020, and still folks think it's ok to settle a dispute by killing the other guy 🙄🤷 . the human race is a sad bunch ……..
I watched the video. The attacker stopped and started to leave when the gun was drawn. There was plenty of time to see him turn away. It wasn’t draw, bam. It was draw, long pause while attacker started to retreat, then bam.
The clear line for me is that there is difference between words and assault. I would’ve drawn, but not shot. The man shot didn’t back off until he drew. It is not Illegal to be an asshole and say something to someone you shouldn’t. It is as big a dick move to say something to someone as it is park in a handy cap spot. Both were dicks.
From there, words are NOT ILLEGAL. It IS however ILLEGAL to commit assualt. From that distance he could’ve kicked that man in the face and killed him. So I think he was right to draw, I don’t believe he was right to shoot. when the man backed off he should have also. If the man stepped toward him that is further attack and deserved as many bullets as it took to stop him.
i know this is a older vid but i have to correct 6:05 Michigan we have both stand on your ground "no duty to retreat" and castle doctrine stand your ground takes outside of your dwelling castle takes in. look at section 780.972
So no one have a fking link to the video?
If we set a PRECEDENT here in America that DEADLY FORCE IS AUTHORIZED on SIMPLE altercations like this? We will QUICKLY ESCALATE AND DEVOLVE into the wild wild west. I've been assaulted much worse. Can we now shoot ppl if punched in the face? What about if someone spits on you with COVID-19 floating around?
Would have been nice to have seen the video for context.
Old guy instigated with words. Entitled miscreant instigated with violence.
Was he threatening the woman in the car
Mike your a piece of shit. Look at how you described the situation.
Me carrying my fresh crisp Kimber
There's no video. 🙄
Nice Motorhead shirt
not anti gun but the situation you described is not justified.
Hey back off florida I love my state
YOU SHOULDN'T DO VIDEOS WHEN YOU'RE SHITFACED… YOU ARE LOSING ANY CREDIBILITY YOU HAVE WITH YOUR VIEWERS.
Alright so I think there are a few things to clear up here…Florida is a Castle Doctrine state as well as Michigan. Castle Doctrine is irrelevant. They are in a public place. I believe Michigan is a duty to flea state, vs stand your ground state. Knowledge is power 💪
Just because you can carry, doesn't mean you can police another citizen.
One man is dead and the other is going away to prison for a long time. All because some stupid broad illegally parked in the handicap spot. Now look I realize that guy was not a cop and it's not for him to enforce that law. But lets be honest here. If you keep doing creepy things like parking in handicap spaces when you are not handicap sooner or later you are going to have an ugly confrontation with someone.
What happened here is the same way that fights usually get started in bars, night clubs and sports events. Some woman either does something obnoxious or starts mouthing off and then her man has to step in to defend her and the next thing you know you have two men fighting that otherwise would not be fighting at all. Just think if that stupid woman had not parked there her boyfriend would still be alive and the other guy would be home with his family.
Colorado has a stand ur ground law. Back when I was a teen I heard a story where a old man shot a young man on the side of the freeway point blank range and got away with it. Why? Here is what happened. These 2 ppl were driving down the rode and the old man cut this kid off by accident. The kid started driving recklessly swerving in and out of lanes and riding this old man's ass. The old man pulled over. The young man pulled up behind him got out of his car ran up to the driver door window yelling and screaming while banging on the window. The old man shot and killed the young man cause the old man feared for his life. Completely justified for the old man. Road rage is a problem in this country. Hell I get raged when driving sometimes too. We all do so be homest.
In my opinion this guy should go to jail for murder. I believe a person that is open carrying or concealed carried they shouldn't be causing a dispute argument fight argument or anything that should cause a problem. If someone came up to a person concealed carrying and cause a problem then I would understand him standing his ground. Basically a I can conceal carry walk up to someone I dont like for whatever reason, create a problem make someone put there hands on me then shoot them. That would be a way for ppl to claim self defence just to kill someone. That's why I say a person with a gun shouldnt cause problems then pretend ur life was in harm's way. If the guy would have minded his business not cause a confrontation this innocent man would still be alive. And just so everyone knows I own guns im not a snowflake tree hugging person. I believe and support or God given rights..
Literally everyone is this situation is stupid… of corse it’s Florida. 🙄
I dont know if i found the right video but it looks like after the push down the man continued to advance until the gun was reveled, NOT turned/ing away. Lawful and just shooting to protect oneself. Secondly the man that was pushed down so violently "could" have also died from an awkward landing cracking the skull, or a mirade of other possibilities, it sucks for the family of Markeis. He took life threatening action and lost his life for doing so. What this video proves is that Markeis had intent to continue life threatening action after pushing down that man, only realizing that moment that the roles were reversed after the fact. The man didnt pull his gun until a continued advance was made. Markeis intent was to go to the ground and give a few punches or just as likely kill someone his own bare hands, notice the way he hikes up his shorts, the body language indicates "Im going to make you bleed and if i feel like it kill you". He isnt adjusting his shorts to help the man back up, no, he is hiking his pants up to show how tuff he thinks he is and that he going to beat someone till the ground is red. Markeis death was lawful and just. This wasn't about race this was about saving his own life and only shot once, didnt unload on him then get up reload and continue to unload. it was one clean shot, a DEFENSIVE center body aimed shot.
Markeis intent MAY have been to kill someone or to put someones life at risk. Cut and clear for me beyond any reasonable doubt. If i was the Judge, case dismissed it VERY evident on intent of both sides.
The only racism I see here is by folks that are saying because white shot black its racism. NOTHING in this video shows this in the slightest, this wasnt a hate crime this was self defense.
The man initiated this. It was not an issue of someone on your property. If he had handled it by calling the police or telling the store mgr. it may have been a different issue.
I love that that peice of shit got shot, should be law everywhere, maybe then people would start acting right, was shooting him too far? Well was shoving that old man to the ground violently too far? Thugs gunna get shot who cares that's what they get for being a thug we are all safer now
both parties are clearly in the wrong but I slightly lean in favor on the old man's side.
There's different ways to look at it say you come out the store and I'm standing there yelling at your wife and children. Would you come up and push me away? Is it stand your ground to get the stranger away from your wife and children while he's screaming at them?
Thank God that guy went to prison that wasn't a justifiable shoot if he would have pushed me on the ground I might have pulled my gun and make sure he doesn't try to come at me again. But what he did was Revenge. Not self defense
This guy got convicted, he's a wanna be cop. His affirmative defense the "Stand Your Ground" failed. It's like the guy who shot into a car because of loud music. Both got what they deserved, fuck them both.
Ok for u guys that dont live in florida and dont understand floridian mentality/insanity i will explain………….
1) in this state people are insane, (the further south u go the worse it gets)
2) u dont get in an argument with anyone here because of idiots like the guy who shot that guy in the parking lot. As soon as u get taped in the face or push people cower behind whatever weapon they can find (which is what happened in clearwater)
3) because law makers realized that this state is full of mentally insane people they realized that a castl doctrine was useless at protecting people outside their home (and actually that is pretty true). So they extended the castle doctrine to your private veichle and enacted stand your ground laws. Which makes sense to protect u outside of ur veichle so u dont have to worry as much about the law if u actually have to shoot somone in self defense.
Now lets talk about this incident.
As a gun owner myself I am absolutly disgusted at this moron who commited that shooting in clear water. If u are not a police officer u have no buisiness taking the role of law enforcment even if u see other people breaking the law (unless somones life is in danger). If it angers u so much that this ignorant driver parks in a handicap parking space and u want to be a regular florida dick, take a pic of the license plate and the area where the handicap tag should be displayed but isnt. Send it to the police or even take it a step further and send it to the property management, they will send a tow truck to remove the veichle. That will cost the bitch 250$ in towing and 200$ for the handicap ticket. I dont know about u but 450$ to park sounds like a great enough punishment for the ignorant cunt.
But instead u commence an argument knowing u are packing heat (carring a gun) and dont think for a secound that the mammouth of a boyfriend isnt going to step in and knock the shit out of u? This is florida! We dont argue here! People are violent and crazy! Guy comes and knocks the shit out of u. Well thats the moment u either back away or u fight back (if u have a gun, u back off or pull out the taser (yes i carry a taser incase the guy is just throwing fists). This is not the time to pull out ur firearm and lay waste to somone because ur a pussy. A gun is an enormous responsibility and clearly this guy should not be carring. Incidents like this give lunatic liberals ammunition to push for gun control.
Im all for gun rights but definetly against guns in the hands of dumbasses who are mentally incapable of thinking.
That person that shot the man is scum bag I hope that he’s in jail for murder
Just because he. Was shoved duz not mean that you have the right to kill
I would have shot, too. Not gonna lay there and wait for someone to start stomping on my head or something.
The BIG guy has probably been pushing people around all his life. The other guy has probably been sticking his nose in other people's business all his life. The moment of truth finally caught up with both of them. The result of both behaviors finally reared it's ugly head. It all goes back to what we should have been taught at a you age. RESPECT. Treat others the way you would like to be treated.
This is the big problem with this law in Florida. We are also seeing cases were criminals using this law for defence on shooting cases. I do believe the law is to vague. I do agree we should have the right to defend my self but this law has some flaws.
I dont think its a civilians place to police other civilians, we have the police for that…he could have called the police about it “if” its that big of a deal…and if its not, why confront someone? You cant possibly know what someone else will consider to be an appropriate response, or if that person cares about being appropriate. Help your self out and dont start stuff 😆
Fear of being disarmed? Could have been a factor. In some cases carrying a weapon compels you to use it.
If you lay your hands on someone, you should expect them to defend themselves.
If someone shoves me like this I DO NOT KNOW if they are going to pull a gun on me or not.
I am going to defend myself because I TRULY AND REASONABLY believe that I might end up with serious bodily harm.
So yeah. I'd shoot, but only after trying to deescalate the situation.
Might be brutal, but it's common sense in my opinion.
I think that he should try to deescalate the situation instead of shooting right away, but nevertheless the shooting was excused, people don't think clearly when they are put in extremely stressful situations.
Throwing people around was not excused. This was not an appropriate reaction.
The only argument I would have is did the guy whom did the shoving think that the dude that shot was trying to attack or cause harm to the occupants of the car.
I dont think Stand your Ground Law applies here… The video that I saw, after he pushed the shooter to the ground he doesnt seem to have the means to go back at it and continue assaulting the old guy… he had time to draw his gun out, aim and shoot and there was a good distance between the two… I dont see the life or dead situation to require lethal force… IDK just my opinion… PS: excuse my broken english but you get the point….
"Now, if I walked out of the store, and somebody had Sherri gripped up, you'd better believe, that guy is not waking up."
Yay for husbands.
The guy shoved him to the ground and stood over him. The 47 year old went for his gun as soon as he saw this guy standing over him and he shot him within 4 seconds of drawing his pistol. The perpetrator took a half step back only after he saw the gun…which was within 2 seconds of the 47 year old drawing it. The perpetrator was not even remotely trying to retreat, and was in fact advancing, up until 2 seconds before he was shot one time in the front.
This 47 year old guy must have thee dumbest fucking criminal defense attorney in the state of Florida.
The guy was on his ass after being pushed violently to the ground. SYG (or Castle Doctrine) has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with this case. You should have addressed the Tueller Rule – that is applicable to this case.
Getting blind sided is definitely a scary thing to experience when you are just going to the store so I can understand if the shooter had fear for his life. This is one of those things where the shot wasn't necessary, but taking into account all the information from the shooter's point of view, I think it was a reasonable reaction.
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